Retained on TDRL

H

hebert0911

PEB Forum Regular Member
Got a letter yesterday.
Subject: Retention on Temporary Disability Retired List (TDRL) - Informal Reconsideration

1. This Physical Evaluation Board (PEB) has reconsidered its previous rating of 13 Nov 08. As a result of that review, the PEB recommends that you be retained on the TDRL with reexamination on or about July 2010.

2. Since you have been retained on the TDRL, your disability rating remains unchanged, therefore, no appeal of these proceedings is authorized. If, upon review, the U.S. Army Physical Disability Agency modifies the recommendation, you will be notified and advised of your appeal rights.

3. For additional information about the Ft. Lewis PEB and the Army Physical Disability Evaluation System, visit our web site at: https://www.hrc.army.mil/active/site/tagd/pda/ftlfront.htm




SO.... when I appealed, I requested a formal board. My attorney felt I should be placed onto PDRL, more importantly he felt my right knee should have been included in the first FPEB. I have two concerns:
1. Now I have to go through this all over again in 18 months, I don't look forward to the stress AGAIN! It causes major set backs each time.

2. I have a lawyer now who feels my knee should have been included previously, what happens if my lawyer at the next one does not agree and doesn't push for this? I feel like I had a good representative and now among all my other worries is that next time I won't.

I know its worrying about what I can't control, but that is kind of what I do now. I get anxious about the stuff I shouldn't...

When I requested a formal board with appearance, don't they have to give me the board?

I know this seems strange, but going through this a 3rd time just isn't something I want to deal with.

Any advice?

thanks,

Dan
 
the stress, ,loss of sleep anxiety and depression that comes along w/all this is something else to consider. are you currently being treated for any mental health or sleep disorders? i would would be a good thing, not only for your rating, but for your overall health. i have been getting treatment for PTSD, anxiety/depression and sleep since my injury. i intially went to mental health on base but that didn't work out too well, so i have been going on my own to the VA's veterans center and it's the best thing i've done. just something to consider, if you already haven't. good luck!
 
I am currently seeing a Navy psychiatrist and a civilian psychologist regularly. I also get weekly acupuncture. I haven't improved in the past 4 years and the whole PEB process just exacerbates all of my problems. I haven't slept anywhere near well in 4 years but in the past two months*since I got the letter saying I was going to have to go through another appeal* I have slept terribly, 3-4 hours a night if I sleep at all. This whole process is incredibly stressful, when you have anxiety and depression it just makes everything worse. Now I get to look forward to them putting me through this again in 18 months... awesome!
 
hebert0911,

sorry to hear about the tdrl...I'm just on my first leg of it all. Its crazy stressful and I can't imagine years of this...so you have my empathy...

I know you said you have a lawyer...but, you might want to consider talking to Jason-pebforum administrator and see if he couldn't help you.
Obviously he's involved with the boards ALOT. He may have the insight you need to get on the PDRL...every situation is different and each lawyer knows different stuff. If you haven't looked at his home page its www.peblawyer.com Its kind of like having the right tool for the job! I learned that from my daddy-yes I was listening! Having the right lawyer, for the right case.....just my opinion.

Thats all the advice I have...other than keep taking care of yourself. My acupuncture treatments really help relieve stress and reduce the pain-its helped me get to the point that I can move around...may not be healed-but its helped!

Take care,

Chinook
 
I second what Chinook said. :) I am sorry for your struggles.

On a side note for those who are getting acupuncture....how do you get that? Is it through the VA or...??? I am thinking we need to try that for my DH and see if it helps any. Yesterday he was a mess. <sigh>
 
DragonFly,

I'm so glad you asked about the acupuncture...I need your help. And-the help of anyone else interested in getting TRICARE to approve benefits for oriental medicine/acupuncture. ( :

I have to pay. I assume we all have to pay right now, unless you are lucky enough to be by one of the Army hospitals that have medical doctors who are trained to do acupuncture. Andrews and Landstuhl for sure have docs who are doing acupuncture-but I'm not sure they do all over the body-and that's what help too. Not just ears.

Dr. Richard Niemtzow (active duty medical officer) is in charge of the acupuncture program. Anyone can google his name in reference to acupuncture and many articles come up...I emailed him at his private email. I asked him about support with getting TRICARE to cover acupuncture: his quote:
"I think we are a long way off for TRICARAE Benefits for CAM. There are many CARE modalities that do not work that great TRICARE should start with acupuncture and make a demonstration project. They certainly know we are doing it at Andrews but no interest in this technology on their end. In April I become the President of the American Academy of Medical Acupuncture; perhaps I can be more political. Right now I do not even have enough help to care for everyday patients even the war wounded. "

In my opinion the time is now. I have written TRICARE and the response was
"TRICARE Policy Manual specifically excludes Acupuncuture from coverage. Your elected officials are the only ones who can change this."

I have contacted Colorado's elected officials and I have had 0 response.

There are so many of us that know that acupuncture helps reduce pain and symptoms. I would rather take needles in my leg than synthetic pills down my throat. I feel better and I can still think. In the long run, acupuncture is cheaper than the drugs....sometimes one will still need drugs, but less.

So, I need help pushing this forward. Jason has been awesome about posting the acupuncture stories/ links that he comes across.

Who wants to help? Its our right to have the choice to the care we need.

Good health to all!

Felicia aka Chinook



 
DragonFly,

I got on my soapbox and forgot to say....I'm sure acupuncture has the potentional to help DH. It has a calming affect. It is also known to help PTSD!!! yes, that's why I don't understand why we can't get this going. The list for PTSD guys/gals to get in to see PCM's and counselors is too long...they are given pills and told to go home. Well, one of those guys was a marine who went back to his barracks and killed himself. No one knew that he was dead for 3 days!! Just maybe, maybe if he had been able to have alternative care-SOME care at all, he might not have felt so alone and helpless! According to an article in the army times ((www.army.mil) search acupuncture) 85% of the people who used acupuncture had relief. Oh and it said there are 40 licensed DoD acupuncturists. Anyway, range of motion is increased, decreased pain...and overall sense of well-being is increased!

I am so tired of the politics...I am so tired that I am ready to take up this fight-to Capitol Hill-and have acupuncture approved. Too many of us need it NOW, not later.

So, I'm sorry to hear that you guys had a rough day. If you were here in Colorado I'd take you to the hot springs pool thats about 30min from my house. Does wonders ( :

Take care,

Chinook
 
Ohhhh, hot springs! We were at Glenwood Springs a couple of summers ago. I am simply jealous that you get to live in the beautiful state of Colorado!

On a serious note...you better believe I am happy to help shake things up to get the coverage through Tricare. I have a few connections in DC, if that matters. I am currently working on getting a bill passed through Congress to offer civil relief to wounded vets. While I go through those channels, why not kill two birds with one stone? I don't see why not.

Personally, I'd love to know if acupuncture would work for DH. The only way to find out is to try. I know a LOT of people who have seen improvements for a variety of problems.

I first became intrigued about Chinese medicine when DH went to see a DoD dental provider. In the course of his treatment, the technician said "I can tell you have lower back pain." He was really confused how she knew when all she was doing was digging around his mouth. LOL She explained that she does something called "tongue mapping" and explained how it works. She went on to say she can tell if someone has had their gallbladder removed because the tongue has a dark spot that appears in the very back on one side. I was astounded that the tongue can tell so much about a person.

It's not widely known among mainstream patients, but apparently a lot of Chinese medicine holds a lot of merits. You've already got the data, so perhaps we can put our brains together and start getting something together and push for approval.

I will make some phone calls to find a provider in our area. Thanks so much!

ETA: I made some calls and got him in on Thursday for his first appointment. When I told DH what I did, he said "MMmmmmKAY! That sounds really kooky. How much is this going to cost?" LOL We can assume he's a REAL skeptic but I am desperate right now. I will let you know how it goes.
 
I go to Pacific College of Oriental Medicine here in San Diego. The senior interns, I believe they are in their 4th or 5th year of grad school, give the treatment with a doctor supervising. The treatments are 30.00 each with military discount and last for about 60 to 75 minutes. I went to a regular acupuncturist and it was 80 for a 45 minute treatment. I saw that tricare specifically does not cover acupuncture.

As far as doctors on base who do the treatment... if they are there they would likely be in the Neurology clinic. The mental health clinic at Naval Medical Center San Diego at Balboa had a Psychiatrist who was also an acupuncturist for a while. She was doing a study on the effects of acupuncture on PTSD patients. She got deployed :( What an awesome background she has though, they treat PTSD with lots and lots of pills, she can offer something different.

It is frustrating to have to pay for the care, but I think I am lucky to have PACOM close by to get the cheap rate. They have schools in New York and maybe elsewhere. Look into it locally, it is a great deal and the providers are excellent.

My wife is a new found believer in acupuncture. She tried it three times in Nov/Dec and has noticed a lot of difference in pain management. She has 3 appointments in January. Better alternative to taking pain pills.
 
DragonFly,

I feel blessed-I love bein' a Colorado girl. I've always been "out-doorsy"...I remember my brother and I taking the train up to Glenwood Springs to meet our dad who worked up there on occassion. We'd have a blast as kids in that big pool! Now my sister and her husband come by about once every two weeks and take me about 30minutes out to our local hotspring. It makes such a difference!!! I'm glad you and DH were able to experience it!

I must tell you that I'm excited to have your help and connections! Heck yes. Whatever it takes. Its the right thing. TRICARE should be covering this. It works for me and I have seen it work for others. The acupuncturists have to be licensed. As for the tongue mapping-isn't that something!!! I seriously think the world of my Oriental Doctor. He's third generation. He is not only a Chinese Medical Doctor, he holds a Phd and teaches. He's the only Dr of Oriental medicine in the Springs allowed to practice at Penrose Hospital here in town. He goes in once a week to treat patients. This form of medicine has been around a long time. I feel fortunate...I pay $500 for 10 treatments. I have been in his office for 2 hrs at a time. Sometimes its just 30 minutes. Depends. But its important for patients to realize that it MAY take more than one treatment to feel relief-and it also depends on how serious the problem is. Dr. Chien does some Phys therapy stuff too. He does cupping on my back to relieve the nerve pressure ( I swear by it!!!) and he trys to manipulate my spine when its not too tight. He's the real deal all wrapped into one! :rolleyes:TRICARE needs to take care of this.

I really hope DH keeps an open mind about this. If you get a chance, look up the acupuncture story in armytimes. (www.army.mil) Maybe that will give DH a little sense that its ok and its really being looked into by the military. Can't wait to hear how his appointment goes! I'll PM you my phone number. I'm excited to have the help. And its great to hear that you are working on the other bill-you are so very cool!!! You are so very busy! :)

hebert,

Glad to hear you and your wife are getting relief and that you are believers! I agree-so much better than pill popping! Glad to hear there are resources like the University by you. Great suggestions for others. Well, if we have to get signatures to make this pass we'll count on you and your wife.

So exciting!

Chinook
 
Oh my goodness...Penrose Hospital? I know where you live. LOL My son had stitches put in his head at that hospital. :eek:

hebert, I wanted to thank you for sharing this info and your experiences too. I called the local VA and it doesn't appear they offer this....YET! LOL

The price I was quoted was $135 for the first consult/treatment and $75 per visit after that. She seemed VERY caring and knowledgeable but I got tickled when she would stammer over her English and ask me how to say PTSD properly. At first I was concerned that she didn't understand what it was, but then realized it was just a language issue. :rolleyes:

DH has surgery tomorrow. I will let you all know how it goes. We are still waiting to hear back on the TDRL so I guess we will be waiting...and waiting...and waiting....as usual.
 
Its such a small world really!!! How funny. Well, not funny about the stitches-ouch;) But it is a small world.:)

I'm real excited to see how DH's appt with the acupuncturist goes-hopefully he will feel comfortable and it will go great. Its so different than traditional medical appts-these guys actually spend time with you and don't rush you. They know they can help.

Best of luck with the surgery tomorrow-hope it goes smoothly. I'll be thinking about you both, as I know others will be too!

Looking forward to hear how things go.

Have a good night and a great tomorrow!

Chinook
 
Dan,

Welcome! Sorry for jumping in late on this thread, between the holidays and catching up on some work, I have been busy.

hebert0911 said:
SO.... when I appealed, I requested a formal board. My attorney felt I should be placed onto PDRL, more importantly he felt my right knee should have been included in the first FPEB. I have two concerns:

1. Now I have to go through this all over again in 18 months, I don't look forward to the stress AGAIN! It causes major set backs each time.
Click to expand...

I understand fully the stress the system causes. Much of that comes from the uncertainty and lack of info built into the system. I hope learning more about the system here helps alleviate some of that. But at the end of the day, it is a stressful thing.

2. I have a lawyer now who feels my knee should have been included previously, what happens if my lawyer at the next one does not agree and doesn't push for this? I feel like I had a good representative and now among all my other worries is that next time I won't.
Click to expand...
The turnover rate for military attorneys is high. When I was a military PEB attorney, the assignments averaged 6-12 months tops. About pushing for inclusion of an argument, you should discuss your concerns when you are assigned your new attorney. If it is a reasonable argument, they should certainly argue the issues you raise.

I know its worrying about what I can't control, but that is kind of what I do now. I get anxious about the stuff I shouldn't...
Click to expand...
Understandable.

When I requested a formal board with appearance, don't they have to give me the board?
Click to expand...

I know this is not what you want to hear, but the short answer is no. You already had a hearing (or opportunity to demand one) the first time around. Until they change your rating, you are not entitled to a new formal. The key with TDRL cases is to prepare before the re-evaluation. You want to present as much favorable evidence as possible to try to influence the IPEB's findings.

Torrey,

I hope the surgery goes well tomorrow. You are both in my thoughts and prayers.
 
Hello and Happy New Year!

I hope everyone enjoyed it. I did however, it would’ve certainly been nice to be able to dance the night away, but of course my pain did not allow that.

So here is the latest and any last minute advice or assistance would be greatly appreciated.

I spent my first day of the New Year making sure that everyone that I requested to write a letter did so. I’m down two with about six more to go.

My formal hearing is in 12 days, and as it stands now my attorney has told me that according to my recent range of motion, I could go out on TDRL, but it has to be justified.

As of now, I am really nervous for a variety of reasons, of course stepping out of the Navy being the main one, but in addition to that, I am slated to have my fusion (L5/S1) this month.

I just had another caudal done, and my doc had me so upset that day, that I started crying. After not seeing me for several months, he told me that my 30lb weight gain was just terrible and I had to do something to lose the weight.

I had to exercise; okay well I walk daily.. but that is not enough. I am on a 1600 calorie diet and the most I have lost is 4lbs.

So I sucked it up, and you know what I did? I tried pushing through the pain and a week later, I’ve started having sporadic spasms in the middle of my left leg and my original pain has been so strong that on two different days I still felt pain during warm water therapy.

I meet with my surgeon this week, and I will talk to the attorney sometime this coming week. I also talked briefly to my captain and let him know what could possibly happen and he told me to be careful with the TDRL but that was the end of that conversation.

What are the cons of TDRL? Any additional suggestions on preparing for my formal hearing? I’ve done all the attorney has asked?
:rolleyes:
 
Jason,
Thank you, sometimes what we don't want to hear is what we need to hear. TDRL is my last concern right now. New Year's Eve, actually about 11am Dec 31, I was hit by a lady who ran a red light pretty much head on. I'm seriously banged up. Nothing broken but my back and neck are really bad. My left knee slammed into the dash and hurts more than ever, both my ankles, knees, left shin, right arm, wrist, both hands, my head*another concussion*, and my chest and abdomen are in pain. I'm a mess. Now I need a lawyer for personal injury. I've never been in an accident before, but my brother who works for an insurance company said I should retain a lawyer due to the extent of my injuries. Pretty much everything hurts. I've been fortunate to have never had any back or neck problems, now I can't hardly move without being in severe pain. I have my regular acupuncture tomorrow but I've had to depend on percocet and valium to address the pain to this point. Maybe 2009 will be a better year, 2008 sure ended terribly.
Hope your new year went better than mine. I'm thankful to be alive, it could have been much worse. I was going about 30 mph and she had to be going atleast that. Thank god for airbags and well designed cars. My outback, which is now totaled, held up pretty good to protect me. Never saw her coming, she just blew through the light.

Jason said:
Dan,

Welcome! Sorry for jumping in late on this thread, between the holidays and catching up on some work, I have been busy.



I understand fully the stress the system causes. Much of that comes from the uncertainty and lack of info built into the system. I hope learning more about the system here helps alleviate some of that. But at the end of the day, it is a stressful thing.

The turnover rate for military attorneys is high. When I was a military PEB attorney, the assignments averaged 6-12 months tops. About pushing for inclusion of an argument, you should discuss your concerns when you are assigned your new attorney. If it is a reasonable argument, they should certainly argue the issues you raise.


Understandable.



I know this is not what you want to hear, but the short answer is no. You already had a hearing (or opportunity to demand one) the first time around. Until they change your rating, you are not entitled to a new formal. The key with TDRL cases is to prepare before the re-evaluation. You want to present as much favorable evidence as possible to try to influence the IPEB's findings.

Torrey,

I hope the surgery goes well tomorrow. You are both in my thoughts and prayers.
Click to expand...
 
OMG. Thank goodness you are alive and actually-with your car totalled, it does sound like you are doing great. So sorry to hear of your accident.

Well, things like that put everything right into perspective-you know. :rolleyes:

Hope you have access to a hot tub-a good long soak wouldn't hurt.

Talk to you soon. Rest.

Chinook
 
Sorry to hear about your accident. I hope you get some pain relief and all goes well for you.
 
Happy Monday to everyone!


The clock is winding down, and I talked to my attorney today. After submitting the letters of members of my chain of command, my attorney told me that the board wants to see me.

I was hoping to get this resolved prior to flying out, but now I have no choice to go and the comment was that now instead of the original 40% it is now down to 20% and that because my command provided a positive NMA they want to see me.

The problem my command is weighing everything on how I was before I started having my problems with my back and I don't think they understand what I am going through.

My husband has submitted a letter on how I am unable to do chores in the house and cook. I tried to fix a nice breakfast Sunday and I was in so much pain that I never got up that day. GRRRRRRRRRRRR

And if I try to go for a fit finding, my detailer has already said that if I can't screen for sea duty that they would ask me to separate.
 
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