Non-LOD/LOD Medical Discharge

I just relized that I may have made a mistake.
I was just honorably discharged two weeks ago due to medical conditions of asthma and allergies with weekly injections.
I wanted to obtain severance.
After looking back at the paperwork the TAG PEB gave me, I have noticed that it is a NON-LOD Memorandum that I signed. This ultimately precluded me from going to a MEB.
During my post deployment MEDPROS evaluation, I stated that I was having trouble breathing from all the sand, dust and bacteria I breathed in from sand storms, etc.
Exacly after I got back to the states, I was diagnosed with asthma for the first time in my life.
I have a signed LOD and my doctor signed a paper stating that my asthma was possibly related to my exposure of these environmental conditions.

Can I still have a MEB turn this around so that I may recieve my entitlements of severance?
What are the policies regarding these matters?
Any help or suggestions are appreciated.
 
Head over to the VA and make an appointment to get a rating.

I often tell my guys not to bother with severance...you'll just have to pay it back to the VA in order to get your full compensation from them.

Good luck!

SGT P
 
OIF,

The question of whether or not to fight for severance depends on several factors. But, incurred in a combat zone, you do not have to "pay back" the VA.

The more important issue is fighting for retirement. If you are on daily inhaler such as Advair, and unfit, then you would be rated at 30% (most likely placed on TDRL for temp pay of 50%).

Most probable route to fight this is BCMR, though, I have seen them "administratively" correct errors by revoking separation orders and referring for processing.

Best of luck!
 
OH! Jason, I'm feeling sheepish! LOL...

Excellent call on the NDAA-related severance for Combat related deal. I didn't even think of it. (Derh!) And it'll be tax free, too! Nice.

I'm quite surprised that the PEB did not ask if it might be related to duty. They usually do...and then they return the case to be processed through the MEB.

I agree on appealing to ABMCR.

Luck!

SGT P
 
SGT P,

No worries. Actually, though this forum is mainly a "karmic good deed" effort on my part, I have found that reading posts and questions is helpful to me in "issue spotting," i.e., it improves my skills in analyzing issues. This is like anything else, the more you train (to use the military context), the more proficient you become.

Here is another thing you may not have caught. I strongly suspect that this member is a discharged reservist.
"the TAG PEB gave me, I have noticed that it is a NON-LOD Memorandum that I signed. This ultimately precluded me from going to a MEB.
During my post deployment MEDPROS evaluation, I stated that I was having trouble breathing from all the sand, dust and bacteria I breathed in from sand storms, etc."

The "TAG" likely refers to The Adjutant General of a State National Guard. The Non-LOD memorandum likely indicates that they never conducted a LOD (they should have) and they just improperly processed his for discharge (and since they did so, it indicates to me that they probably discharged him for "failing medical retention standards"). Nice trick, huh? They hold the lack of LOD against the Soldier, do not initiate one, and then jump to the conclusion that the condition is Non-duty Related. I have seen this numerous times and am fighting it out in a number of cases on appeal. But, this action will not stand if that is factually what happened (I have prevailed on this issue numerous times,...they just keep repeating the same mistakes). The State NGs have a systemic problem with this. So, no MEB, and no PEB, but they discharged him anyway.

OIF, feel free to let us know if any of my assumptions are incorrect.
 
I have WAY too many cases which I've found sent up to the wrong board. I just came back from deployment and adopted a mess of crap...now I'm fixing it. Ugh. The really sh*tty part is that I have to deal with the fallout of IG complaints and Congressionals from those whose cases I'm trying to reconcile....cases I did not screw up in the first place.

Trust me, I understand all too well.
 
SGT P,

Nice avatar! Not enough people use them...I am not sure if we have any other Elektra's.

When I was a JAG, I used to have to respond to Congressionals. By definition, it was someone else's screw up I was responding to, so, yeah, I understand the frustration.

I plan on filing a lawsuit in the next few months to try to fix some of these systemic issues. I know it doesn't help much now, but maybe in the future. Keep you head up, you sound like you are doing great work!
 
Thanks guys. Jason, I wasn't aware of the NDAA changes. Very nice to know.
I'm not quite sure how the ABMCR can help me though. My NGB22 has honorable and in the remarks is typed, "INDIVIDUAL WAS DISCHARGED WITHOUT PERSONAL NOTICE PER NGR 600-200, PARA 8-35L(8)".

This specific regulation states as follows:

"(8) Medically unfit for retention per AR 40-501. Commanders, who suspect that a soldier may not be medically qualified for retention, will direct the soldier to report for a complete medical examination per AR 40-501. If the soldier refuses to report as directed, see paragraph 8-36u below. Commanders who do not recommend retention will request the soldier's discharge. When medical condition was incurred in line of duty, the procedures of NGR 40-3 will apply. Discharge will not be ordered while the case is pending final disposition. RE3."

No where on my NGB22 does it say that I was or was not medically discharged in the LOD or not in the LOD.

There is a seperate memorandum typed up by my state's JFH. I signed it like an idiot thinking that I would go to a MEB where I would explain my situation. I did include the doctors' letter that explained my LOD disease, however that of course was never up loaded to my IPERMS like the memoradum. In any case should I obtain an attorney that deals with these matters of severance for soldiers or do you think I should still go the ABMCR route? Can they as you said Jason, "Most probable route to fight this is BCMR, though, I have seen them "administratively" correct errors by revoking separation orders and referring for processing."

If so, I will get on this immediately before too much time goes by. I was just discharged two weeks ago.

You're right SGT P, I was in the ARNG for 4 years with 3 of them on active duty with no break in service.

Again, thanks for any more input, suggestions, comments, and of course we all have to thank this web site forum of which I'm sure has helped so many. A donation is on my list of things to do.
 
OIF,

Did your Command notify you of the NDRPEB action? This regulation usually applies to Soldiers who are non-compliant in either being medically evaluated, or do not respond to the PEB's correspondence. I'm a bit confused as to how this applies to you. Please shed some light on just what happened...

If you were not properly counseled, or later on properly notified, you likely have a good case for an appeal.

What do you think, Jason?

SGT P
 
SGT P,

I went to my rediness NCO and requested a medical discharge due to my disease. I provided the proper medical documentation as he requested that substantiated my claim and he sent it to our state's medical review office. A couple of weeks later, my rediness NCO provided me with the memoradum that basically said that I agree with the boards findings and will be discharged. I signed it, but I was thinking it was a process to get to the MEB. I really didn't know that two weeks later I would get a call from my rediness NCO stating that I was offically discharged from the ARNG. That's it in a nutshell.
How can I appeal this decision?
What about it Jason? What do you think?
 
If you had a condition that failed retention standards, they should have referred you to the MEB. The fact that you signed this memorandum does not change my opinion. The only thing that they might say is that you waived your right to an MEB/PEB. I would say that argument is weak, a waiver must be knowing and voluntary.

In case you weren't aware, and in the interest of full disclosure, I practice law in this area. As a baseline, I think that it should not take an attorney to file a successful BCMR petition. In many cases, it does not and there are a great many people who succeed by going it alone. However, I have seen a great many cases that were "winnable" but the member did not raise the correct issues. Even more important, in my view, is ensuring that errors that will be important in Federal court, if necessary, are identified. Failure to raise an issue at the BCMR may result in preclusion of that issue later in court. So, it is a tough question. On the one hand, you may do fine without an attorney. However, if you do not, you may have wished you had one. In a way, it is not unlike an insurance policy.

None of this (or anything on this forum) is legal advice. You should establish an attorney-client relationship if you want legal advice.
 
This seems to be a problem with discharges from the Gaurd and Reserve. I have a LOD and went before the board but when I recieved my discharge orders they read no LOD and stated I was not on active duty orders when the LOD occurred. Although the MEB records state that I was. I submitted all paper to prove this issue, but to no avail. But it took them from 2004 to 2008 before I was able to even get a board. I came home needing a total hip replacement and back surgey. (All documented) I do understand what you are going through.
 
Jason,

In the Guard, not all conditions which do not meet retention standards are required an MEB. DoD Instruction 1332.38, definition E2.1.20 (Pg 9) covers NDR impairments for RC.

It sounds like these States are discharging these Soldiers under NDRFD without giving them the other 2 options (NDRPEB or transfer to IRR). I seriously doubt that there is a case manager pulling thier records and reviewing the Soldier's history to determine whether or not an NDR is the right CoA. Pursuant with PEB Policy Guidance Memorandum #4 (encl), the RC is responsible for deciding whether the case should be sent up as LOD or NDR.

The fact that the Soldier was not counseled about their rights is a huge issue here. Both AR 635-200 and the DoDI are explicit in the requirement of properly counseling the Soldier on his rights in each phase of the process.

Lastly, the Soldier is not even supposed to be processed for discharge without an election documented in writing in the case file.

All of this is past-tense for OIF, however. So, in cases like this, what is the next step? Should he contact someone from Soldier's Counsel? Or is he no longer entitled to their help?

I'd be inclined to think that his best bet (both to take care of his own problem, and to identify the problem to his TAG) is to file a Congressional Inquiry.

Thoughts?

SGT P
 
Hmmm. Interesting insight on this SGT P. I'll be waiting for Jason's comment on this as well.
 
Jason,

...It sounds like these States are discharging these Soldiers under NDRFD without giving them the other 2 options (NDRPEB or transfer to IRR). I seriously doubt that there is a case manager pulling thier records and reviewing the Soldier's history to determine whether or not an NDR is the right CoA. Pursuant with PEB Policy Guidance Memorandum #4 (encl), the RC is responsible for deciding whether the case should be sent up as LOD or NDR.

SGT P,

This is not what is going on (at least in the cases I am talking about). I have dealt with NDR cases, and even the ones that have gone through the ostensibly correct procedure, errors were common.

What I am seeing is two common illegal procedures to separate injured/disabled Soldiers (this is an Army Reserve/National Guard problem....Air Reserve Component Airmen have their own different set of "challenges").

1) Soldier fails retention standards. The Command/State Surgeon's office may or may not initiate a Physical Profile. The State Surgeon then sends Soldier a letter telling them that they fail retention standards and that they are being separated. Very often, though there is documentation showing the injury was incurred in the LOD, there is no LOD investigation. Sometimes they offer the NDR board. In the letter it tells them to apply at the Dept. of Veterans Affairs.

2) Soldier has a profile that states he needs an MEB. The State then send them to an MMRB, which finds them unfit (which is neither a permissible nor authorized finding). Soldier is then separated.

A common thread I am seeing is that the units are not conducting LOD investigations, but processing Soldiers for separation on the basis of the member not having an LOD. This is even if the Soldier has more than 8 years of active service and the injury was incurred while deployed or on orders for more than 30 days.

BTW, this is not just an issue with units at the Company level. I have engaged directly with State Adjutants General (2 star Commanders of State NG), State Surgeons (O6 Physicians), and National Guard Bureau Inspectors General. There is a shocking lack of knowledge and almost uniformly, initially they state that they are doing the right thing. I have so far had success after submitting legal arguments getting individual cases rectified. But, this steams me to no end. I know that there are still current cases being improperly processed and I suspect that there are thousands if not tens of thousands of members out there who have been denied access to the physical disability evaluation system.



The fact that the Soldier was not counseled about their rights is a huge issue here. Both AR 635-200 and the DoDI are explicit in the requirement of properly counseling the Soldier on his rights in each phase of the process.
That is correct. This is not an option, it is required by Title 10 Chapter 61, and the regulations.

All of this is past-tense for OIF, however. So, in cases like this, what is the next step? Should he contact someone from Soldier's Counsel? Or is he no longer entitled to their help?

Post separation, he is not entitled to assistance of a JAG.

Even if he were, I have my concerns about using the JAG's. I say this as a former Soldiers' Counsel. There are some very good and competent attorneys. However, there is also a wide variability in the experience that these JAGs have. The training is very limited, too. I have seen very good ones, but a great many are new to this area of law. This is something that I have advocated they change. The JAG Corps should create a department at the JAG School to teach this area of law, they should create a Disability Law Chief (O5 position with a GS 13-14 assistant), and create at least one 04 and three O3 positions on a Soldiers Counsel Assistance Program). This would create experience, continuity, and institutional knowledge in this area of law. I can tell you that there is not much attention paid to this by the JAG Corps, in my opinion.

He most likely needs to file a DD 149, Application for Correction of Military Records. I have it posted on this site (let me know if you can't find it). He may want to consult an attorney.
 
Fabulous info, Jason. I have to say, I'm picking your brain because I know that there may potentially be cases with issues coming back from before I came into the position. I'm trying my very best to be sure to do everything by the reg....but I have to tell you...IT IS TOUGH! Knowing and understanding every little thing is very hard. I open the regs at least 10 times EVERY day. My goal is to have 100% satisfaction with the PROCESS at my level (even if the Soldier may not like that they are being boarded). So far, even though I've had IG in my office, I've been able to use the regulation to justify everything I've done when a Soldier makes a complaint (or the unit is actually the problem).

I don't want to be one of "those" states...even though I know my state might have been one before I became a case manager.

P
 
How many years do you have in the NG? If over 15, you may be able to retire for non service connected disability. As a reserve retirement, it does not pay until age 60 where as "duty related" disability retirements pays right away.

Mike
 
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