Honorable Discharge Changed to "Uncharacterized"

pvt.brittenum

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Over the last year or so ...
I had been going through the MEB/PEB process.
I had been discharged with orders to received an "Honorable Discharge"

Then i receive orders from my Unit saying the order had been changed to "UnCharacterized"
The date of the Honorable Discharge was July 25th 2014

My Unit says i was discharged June 23rd 2014 ...before even leaving the PEB.

I don't understand why they would change the status of my discharge.

I felt this was done maliciously to keep me from obtaining needed benefits.

When i tried to get answers ... my unit said that it was "Regulation" and its Up to the "Commander"
 
Wait isn't uncharacterized a discharge within the first 180 days of service
 
No, you can receive an uncharacterized discharge for a variety of reasons. However, seeing as the SM above completed the MEB, something seems out of place. Under AR 635-200:

3–9. Uncharacterized separations

a. Entry-level-status separation. A separation will be described as entry-level with service uncharacterized if

processing is initiated while a Soldier is in entry-level status, except when—

(1) Characterization under other than honorable conditions is authorized under the reason for separation and is

warranted by the circumstances of the case.

(2) HQDA (AHRC–EPR–F), on a case-by-case basis, determines that characterization of service as honorable is

clearly warranted by the presence of unusual circumstances involving personal conduct and performance of duty. This

characterization is authorized when the Soldier is separated by reason of selected changes in service obligation,

convenience of the Government, and Secretarial plenary authority.

(3) The Soldier has less than 181 days of continuous active military service, has completed Initial Entry Training,

has been awarded an MOS, and has reported for duty at a follow-on unit of assignment (see para 11–3c).

b. Void enlistments. A Soldier will not receive a discharge, characterization of service at separation, or an uncharacterized

description of service if the enlistment or induction is void except when a constructive enlistment arises and

such action is required under b(3), below. If characterization or an uncharacterized description of service is not

required, the separation will be described as an order of release from custody and control of the Army.

(1) An enlistment is void in the following circumstances:

(a) If it was effected without the voluntary consent of a person who has the capacity to understand the significance

of enlisting in the Army. This includes enlistment of a person who is intoxicated or insane at the time of enlistment.

(b) If the person is under 17 years of age.

(c) If the person is a deserter from another military service.

(d) If an enlistee’s erroneous enlistment is discovered prior to the Soldier’s departure from the Military Entrance

Processing Station (MEPS). (See para 7–15e.)

(2) Although an enlistment may be void at its inception, a constructive enlistment will arise in the case of a person

serving with the Army who—

(a) Submitted voluntarily to military authority.

(b) Met the mental competency and minimum age qualifications at the time of voluntary submission to military

authority.

(c) Received military pay or allowances.

(d) Performed military duties.

(3) If an enlistment that is void at its inception is followed by a constructive enlistment within the same term of

service, characterization of service or description of separation will be in accordance with this paragraph and paragraph

3–5 as appropriate.

(4) If an enlistment was void by reason of desertion from another military service, the Soldier will be separated by

an order of release from the custody and control of the Army regardless of any subsequent constructive enlistment.

(5) A constructive enlistment does not preclude the Army from either retaining the Soldier or separating the Soldier

based on the circumstances that occasioned the original void enlistment or any other reason for separation.
 
Yes, a characterization of entry level is only authorized for people whose separation proceedings, or diagnosis of EPTS, is within the first 180 days of service. For a Reservist or Guardsman on the alternate training program (BCT one summer, AIT the following summer), it starts after completion of AIT and return to the unit.

What was the reason for the discharge??
 
So the the discharge paperwork probably was started with in conjunction with his MEB or during MEB? Buy I thought MEB overrules
 
While the appropriateness of this has been debated in this forum, in practice a soldier who is in entry level who has been diagnosed with an EPTS condition will be discharged without benefits unless there is a clear indication of service aggravation. A PEB would not be convened.
 
I went through the Full Process and Received Disability Rating from PEB ...
I am also due Severance Pay...
 
I went through the Full Process and Received Disability Rating from PEB ...
I am also due Severance Pay...
how long were you in service? how did MEB get initiated
 
While the appropriateness of this has been debated in this forum, in practice a soldier who is in entry level who has been diagnosed with an EPTS condition will be discharged without benefits unless there is a clear indication of service aggravation. A PEB would not be convened.

In the past, the rule was that members with a Non-waivered EPTS condition may have been denied a PEB in the following situation:

"E3.P2.5. Members with a Nonwaivered Pre-Existing Condition
Service members who are identified with nonwaivered medical conditions or physical defects that existed prior to service may be administratively separated without referral into the DES when the medical condition meets all the criteria listed in subsections E3.P2.5.1. through E3.P2.5.4., below:

E3.P2.5.1. The medical impairment is identified prior to or within 180 days of the member's initial entry on active duty or active duty for training or full-time National Guard duty.

E3.P2.5.2. The medical impairment does not meet accession standards under DoD Directive 6130.3 (reference (f)).

E3.P2.5.3. The impairment is not a condition that is cause for referral to the PEB under enclosure 4 or Service supplemental medical standards.
E3.P2.5.4. Service aggravation of the impairment has not occurred. If the Service member contests the 'not Service aggravated' determination by the physician recommending separation, the member may request the MEB be forwarded to the PEB for review."

DoDI 1332.38.

However, the service aggravation is still presumed and the members does not need to show "clear" service aggravation. The military would need to show- at least under the regulation cited- that the aggravation has not occurred by a preponderance:

"E3.P4.5.2.3. Presumption of Aggravation. The presumption that a disease is incurred or aggravated in the line of duty may only be overcome by competent medical evidence establishing by a preponderance of evidence that the disease was clearly neither incurred nor aggravated while serving on active duty or authorized training."

However, this was changed with the 2008 NDAA:

"E3.P4.5.2. Presumption for Members on Active Duty for More than 30 days. The
presumptions listed in E3.P4.5.2.1., through E3.P4.5.2.3., below apply to members on orders to
active duty of more than 30 days, for purposes of determining whether an impairment was
incurred or aggravated while a member was entitled to basic pay.

E3.P4.5.2.2. After Entry
E3.P4.5.2.2.1. Presumption of Sound Condition for members ordered on active
duty for more than thirty days. This presumption applies in all cases in which a member,
on active duty for more than 30 days is found to have a disability and the disability was not
noted at the time of the member’s entrance on active duty. This presumption is overcome
if clear and unmistakable evidence demonstrates that the disability existed before the
Service member’s entrance on active duty and was not aggravated by military service.
Absent such clear and unmistakable evidence, the PEB will conclude that the disability was
incurred or aggravated during military service."

DoD Policy Memorandum on Implementing Disability-Related Provisions of the National Defense Authorization Act of2008 (Pub L. 110-181) (October 8, 2008.

So, the later rule is that there must be clear and unmistakable evidence to overcome the presumptions.

Now, under the latest DES regulation, DoDI 1332.18, Para. 7, here is the similar rule (restated):

"b. Presumption of Sound Condition for Members on Continuous Orders to Active Duty Specifying a Period of More Than 30 Days
(1) The Secretaries of the Military Departments will presume Service members, including RC members and recalled retirees, on continuous orders to active duty specifying a period of more than 30 days entered their current period of military service in sound condition when the disability was not noted at the time of the Service member’s entrance to the current period of active duty.
(2) The Secretaries of the Military Departments may overcome this presumption if clear and unmistakable evidence demonstrates that the disability existed before the Service member’s entrance on their current period of active duty and was not aggravated by their current period of military service. Absent such clear and unmistakable evidence, the Secretary of the Military Department concerned will conclude that the disability was incurred or aggravated during their current period of military service."

DoDI 1332.18, APPENDIX 3 TO ENCLOSURE 3

So, under current rules, unless a condition was noted on entry, a member on orders of 30 days or more (including IET trainees) will have the presumptions of service incurrence and aggravation that can only be overcome by clear and unmistakable evidence.
 
A very good outline of how the DoDI has changed over the years concerning EPTS Jason.

What normally happens in a disease process is the military will cite accepted medical opinion (Merck Manual) on the condition as pertains to time between inception of the condition and time the symptoms surface and the natural rate of progression.

In congenital conditions the only thing which would sway an EPTS ruling would be competent medical opinion that stress would worsen the condition. But even then, the PEB would deduct the EPTS portion of the condition from the final rating.
 
Just remember there is a distinction from a congenital condition and a genetic/hereditary condition. One is born with a congenital condition which is stable and connot change in severity over time. A genetic/hereditary condition can manifest later and vary in degree of impairment. What is critical is when the condition manifested. If it manifested, or became aggravated,while on active duty it is compensable. Often the services (PEBs and BCNRs) don't understand this difference and treat genetic/hereditary conditions as if they were congenital. If so, you will need to educate them on the difference.

Mike
 
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Just remember there is a distinction from a congenital condition and a genetic/hereditary condition. One is born with a congenital condition which is stable and connot change in severity over time. A genetic/hereditary condition can manifest later and vary in degree of impairment. What is critical is when the condition manifested. If it manifested, or became aggravated,while on active duty it is compensable. Often the services (PEBs and BCNRs) don't understand this difference and treat genetic/hereditary conditions as if they were congenital. If so, you will need to educate them on the difference.

Mike
If a soldier has symptoms (such as headaches) during his second week of basic combat training, and the doctor says it is being caused by a brain tumor which is large enough to have been growing for 8 months, do you think it would be determined to have been incurred in line of duty?
 
If a soldier has symptoms (such as headaches) during his second week of basic combat training, and the doctor says it is being caused by a brain tumor which is large enough to have been growing for 8 months, do you think it would be determined to have been incurred in line of duty?

This is a very good question to illustrate the problems with adjudications of these issues.

As a baseline, I would not dispute that this probably would be EPTS/Not Service Aggravated. (But, to really know, you would need a full set of facts). However, it is rare for such a finding to be properly made.

Assuming that it was not noted on entry (e.g., MEPS physical), the question is whether or not the evidence is
"clear and unmistakable...that the disability existed before the Service member’s entrance on their current period of active duty and was not aggravated by their current period of military service." (Recall that BCT orders will be more than 30 days...so a strict reading of the regulations says it does not matter that the headaches are found in the first two weeks of BCT, the same presumptions and evidentiary standards apply).

Assuming further that the PEB states that the condition is EPTS/Not aggravated, this is not enough. Why? Because the regulation further specifies that:

(3) The Secretary of the Military Department concerned must base a finding that the Service member’s condition was not incurred in or aggravated by their current period of military service on objective evidence in the record, as distinguished from personal opinion, speculation, or conjecture. When the evidence is unclear concerning whether the condition existed prior to their current period of military service or if the evidence is equivocal, the presumption of sound condition at entry to the current period of military service has not been rebutted and the Secretary of the Military Department concerned will find the Service member’s condition was incurred in or aggravated by military service."

And the regulation defines "clear and unmistakable evidence," as "Undebatable information that the condition existed prior to military service or if increased in service was not aggravated by military service. In other words, reasonable minds could only conclude that the condition existed prior to military service from a review of all of the evidence in the record."

So, returning to the hypothetical, even if it was likely or very likely that the tumor started and grew before entry, if there exists tumors of the type the trainee has that grow very fast or are worsened by anything faced by trainees (be it sleep deprivation, stress, physical exercise), then the condition SHOULD be compensable.

The problem I routinely see is that the PEBs just state the conclusion- "This condition is EPTS/Not Service Aggravated. The clear and unmistakable evidence shows that the tumor began before SM's entry into service and was not service aggravated."

On such a record, the result should be that the condition is compensable. There is no citation to objective facts supporting the opinion.

It would be different if they wrote, instead, "The Soldier's tumor currently measures approximately 4 cm per the PET Scan conducted on DATE. After a biopsy and analysis of the tumor, the tumor is a type classified as a PNET. According to the American Journal of Oncology, these tumors have a rate of growth from between 2-4 cm over a period of 2-3 years and are typically first incurred before age 17 with a steady growth rate. See Smith and Jones, Juvenile PNET Tumors and Progression, Amer. J. Onc. Vol 2, Sept 19, 2014, 111-113. The same article also notes that there are no identified environmental factors that impact progression. Therefore, the PEB finds the condition to be EPTS and not aggravated by service." (The citation and facts are completely fictional...there are tumors called PNETs but, I have no idea about their progression, causes, etc....and the citation is made up, too). In such a case, then I would be hard pressed to say that the PEB erred. (However, I would also cross check the journal article and other articles to see if there are variants, or identified cases with different factual circumstances.).

The huge problem with cases is that the PEB does not do the "heavy lifting" of properly explaining its decision. Then on appeal, there is little objective statements to challenge. Which, if the SM continues to appeal, will often times result in a remand to answer questions that cannot be answered- e.g., "what are the objective facts that the PEB relied on in coming to the conclusion that the condition was not incurred or service aggravated by 'clear and unmistakable' evidence?" I have had several cases where this has been an issue and just last month got a decision from Court of Federal Claims where an EPTS/Not Service Aggravated finding was overturned by the Court. (Part of the decision was based on the PEB and the Army not ever properly addressing the distinction between ordinary conditions and hereditary/genetic conditions...the above hypo does not seem to directly implicate that issue).
 
What Jason said. It depends If there is clear and unmistakable evidence (all authorities are in agreement) that condition preexisting active duty and was not aggravated on active duty. It is a very tough burden to overcome the presumptions when done correctly and too often it is not done correctly to standard.

Mike
 
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To add, I have seen many PEB findings for genetic/hereditary conditions that state EPTS just because the condition has a genetic/hereditary basis. The PEBs erroneously believe that genetic/hereditary equals EPTS and the only issue is aggravation. That is incorrect. The PEB must determine when the condition actually manifested.

Mike
 
I have said this once before, and I will say it again. I love the wealth of information that is available on the forum for all the SMs. If only it existed when I went through the process.
 
What does all this information have to do with me being issued an "Honorable Discharge" from the PEB ...
Then having it changed to "Uncharacterized" by my national guard unit??
 
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